🥇 Athletics Department Strategery

[buzby]

!

I recall folks thought it was fun when Mike Curtis earned his and could go by Dr. This is a dumb thing to get twitterpated about and a dumber thing to be inconsistently twitterpated about.

[4547Lambeth]

@buzby

went to a moderated panel this weekend and this was mentioned. Apparently Miss St fields 16 programs to our 27(ish, can’t recall precisely). That plus the disparity in TV money is tough to overcome.

I’ve made this point so many times in this thread. We field more sports than SEC schools and our scholarships cost way more each than for SEC schools. We also receive way less TV money and sell fewer tickets. We’re much more reliant on personal donations than SEC schools.

Also, when sports were on scholarship limits instead of roster limits, you could much more easily justify a non-rev sport on a straight P&L basis. In FY24 the baseball program had 2.7 mil revenue and 6.1 mil expenses, but the team was limited to 10.1 scholarships, so 785k in student aid expenses. There were 37 guys on the 2024 roster, so 27 were paying full freight minus financial aid, 12 in state. Tuition and fees is about 20k in state and 60k out of state, making a wild guess that financial aid grants covered half of it, that’s 12 guys who pay 10k and 15 guys paying 30k, which is 600k (could be up to 1.2 mil) in tuition revenue directly attributable to baseball.

Now that the top baseball programs have 34 scholarships or 25 plus 5% on rev share (about 1 mil), the roster’s not bringing in 600k-1.2 mil tuition revenue and scholarship expenses have increased by about 1.8-2 mil, that’s a 3 mil net additional cost.

This is going to be the case for every sport and I wouldn’t be surprised if we need to drop 5-10 teams. The SEC doesn’t sponsor men’s soccer or wrestling, men’s or women’s lacrosse or field hockey. Even with our good history in some of those sports, they’d be easy to justify dropping in a conference move.

[dave92]

True, but I don’t recall him ever being referred to as “Dr. Curtis.”

Point is it’s not a diss to call her Carla. It’s born of familiarity, indicating she’s “one of ours.” Like Oak and Tony and Bronco and Odom and Elliott (who would probably be “Tony” if we didn’t already have one).

[uva123]

We really need to cut sports. People care about losing BOC and sucking at baseball, relative to how much people care about wrestling, rowing, field hockey, etc. Unfortunately it’s now too late and we have totally start over as a baseball program but it’s time to trim the fat and become more lean like the SEC

[60611]

2.5 million Americans have PhDs, and millions more could if they wanted. There are more PhDs than lawyers in this country, uh, I mean juris
doctors. Only a low achiever would think it’s “a ridiculously hard thing to get.”

You are the one that needs to learn about the school, junior. The thing that sticks out about you calling her Dr., in addition to coming off as a total fanboy, is that there is a long-held tradition at the school not to refer to people as Dr., since Jefferson never was one. Stupid and pretentious, like “first year” or “grounds” or “The University,” sure, but still a thing and makes your posts emphasizing her doctorate as some sort of unique honor that trumps all else, even more ludicrous.

I can’t remember anyone insisting on referring to someone associated with UVa athletics as Dr. The closest thing was calling Robert Anae, “Dr. Bob” and it was done derisively.

[haney]

Beat you to it again @DFresh11

[60611]

Glad I’m not sick

[norfolk_hoo]

Then we’re fine by those standards too. You get to add the revenue from a very large market DC and a bunch of solid secondary markets.

[MaineWahoo]

I think we will be included in the next round of SEC/BIG expansion if it happens. I’m weirdly not worried about it. I think we’re just too attractive due to our location/institutional qualities. But the ACC needs to actually finally die so we can get out. Right now we’re just withering on the vine.

The fact that we sponsor so many additional sports is why I’d prefer the BIG as a landing spot. That plus the academic fit. I get the pure sports fandom perspective of wanting to be in the SEC, and I’d be fine with it, but I lean BIG.

Regardless, cutting a few sports is likely useful unless they can completely self-fund on donations. Wrestling obviously, maybe rowing. Would have said volleyball but somebody pointed out one of our big donors is a volleyball alum so that may not be wise. Would have also said golf before the run to the finals. Can cross country be knocked off while keeping track and field or are they like the same thing? I have no idea. Anyway. Some trimming around the edges probably wouldn’t hurt.

[StLouHoo]

Technically lawyers are doctors!

[dave92]

@MaineWahoo

SEC/BIG expansion if it happens

I’m interested in the “if it happens” part. For the past 20 years expansions were inevitable, but now I wonder if we’re capped out. Prior expansions were done either to keep up or get ahead of other conferences; but the SEC and BIG have no threats now, they are secure at the top. Adding more schools is just dividing up the pie.

If it does happen I think it’ll be as part of an NCAA breakaway, and driven by TV producers designing the next big thing.

[MaineWahoo]

Well let’s hope there’s one more round. If things truly stagnate in their current form we are in some major trouble.

[60611]

Correct, and there are fewer of them than there are PhDs in this country, and very few think being a lawyer is a unique accomplishment.

[zvillehoo]

Agreed. The only real selling point we offer to new TV deals is markets (or the required partner to UNC), which is quickly aging as a paradigm as streaming grows as a mix of total. If we can get Football and Basketball to be nationally relevant again (again → results on the field), then we have a more durable case for inclusion.

[Hooandtrue]

Carla Williams. Fundraising but coaches gone?

Her role in OConner saga

• Carla’s fault
• Not Carla’s fault

[4547Lambeth]

@StLouHoo

Technically lawyers are doctors!

So it’s kinda strange. Up until the 60s, most US law schools awarded LLB (bachelor of laws) degrees first, then LLMs (masters in law) and SJDs(doctorate in juridical science). Then most schools switched from the LLB to the JD(juris doctor), but kept the LLM and the SJD.

Absolute no one refers to a JD as Dr. I’ve never met an SJD, so I don’t know if they’re even called Dr.

But I mean, the only people who get offended by these Dr. titles are MDs, some of whom also get offended by DOs, DDSs, PharmDs and ODs using Dr., and I can’t give fewer craps about this topic.

[dave92]

I’m feeling like we should let Baseball have their thread back so folks can actually talk about baseball there.

Perhaps this thread could be used to discuss such topics as:

• Is Carla doing a good job
• Should we call her Dr. Williams
• What do ADs even do anyway
• Is there a common cause for losing Bronco, Tony, and Oak, or are these unrelated events
• Would we rather join the BIG or the SEC
• What would it take to put ourselves in position to make that happen
• How should we prioritize our spending across sports
• Are there sports we should cut and if so which
• Arby’s (welcome in any thread)

Thanks @jazznutUVA

[dave92]

I would have gone with “don’t know” if that were an option, so figured I should default to not laying blame.

On the one hand, it feels like a fumble. After 20+ years we should have a “hometown bias” with Oak. On the other hand, the $ gap (not to mention competition level) that’s developed between ACC and SEC is so huge that maybe it just couldn’t be overcome no matter what.

[UVAdrian]

@dave92

I’m interested in the “if it happens” part.

It’ll happen again because at some point, the powers that be at the BIG10 and the SEC are going to wonder what exactly do schools like Northwestern, Rutgers, Mississippi State, and Vanderbilt bring to the table in terms of eyeballs and athletic prowess. Aren’t there other schools out there that can bring a more compelling profile? When the tv contracts run up in 2029 and 2030, conference realignment is going to happen again.

[4547Lambeth]

@MaineWahoo

I think we will be included in the next round of SEC/BIG expansion if it happens. I’m weirdly not worried about it. I think we’re just too attractive due to our location/institutional qualities. But the ACC needs to actually finally die so we can get out. Right now we’re just withering on the vine.

I’m with you here, but I don’t know why. VA and NC are the obvious major states where neither conference has a presence, but would want one given their growth and affluence.

If you think about it, athletics has always served as the front porch of a university. Something to welcome in the community and visitors with the hope that some of those people decide to attend the school. The states of VA and NC have lots of people schools in other states would love to attend their schools. You bring your football team in, locals learn about your school and maybe they apply. Or maybe if they can’t get into the local school, they’ll decide to go to the SEC or B1G equivalent.

So I think the conferences would like to acquire the flagship schools of every state if possible. The ones where kids who apply but don’t get in would be academic assets to any other conference school.

Plus, the SEC doesn’t want to go to 9 conference games because they think it’s too hard. They need a break so us being a bad football program isn’t the negative some think it is. We just need to get to respectable.

This is why I think either conference would prefer us over VT.

Also, I was the one who brought up Amy Griffin being a volleyball alum. Otherwise, I could see VB on the chopping block.

But even if we keep all the sports and join the B1G, we’d get the B1G TV and bowl money, but we’ll never sell 100k seats to football games, so we’ll always be behind the big boys in ticket revenue. Would need to trim just so we’re not spread too thin.

Oh and the next round of realignment will occur around 2030. The ACC putting dollar figures on costs to leave the conference at the same time the other conferences’ TV contracts are up almost assures that.