Nope. Completely believe him but even he has no way of knowing how he would have felt if he was playing 30 minutes per game.
Me either for that matter
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I didnât say *anything about him transferring, I was referring to him redshirting as âhis choiceâ, which it was not. He had to be convinced about it. But letâs kick the can down the street because we want to ignore that.
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This. Itâs not a lie to not have a good read on what your own decisions would be under different circumstances. Few of us do! You canât predict the future and you canât properly analyze the past that didnât happen.
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Iâll say it again ⌠who cares if he would have transferred ⌠we would have had high rotation minutes all year for Traudt and Sheds and a higher ceiling in the madness. Shooting was missing the whole 2nd half of the season. Imagine the room Reece would have had with both Isaacâs on the floor?
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That quote was pretty telling to me, I think spoke to what the fit issues might be. Worth reading it in conjunction with Jayâs quote about being adaptable vs. finding a new situation. FWIW, I think what Traudt said was broadly right, thereâs a a level of defensive effort that is non-negotiable, and I think itâs perfectly valid to either decide to adapt to that standard or to decide that a different situation is a better fit for his goals as a player.
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Agreed. One is his actual reaction to something that happened, one is him speculating about something he didnât experience.
Very hard to believe 30 successful mpg in the ACC would have yielded the same outcome - wanting to build on that momentum, etc⌠but Iâm sure he believes that given how it all went down and itâs a nice thing to say.
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How much evidence do folks need to stop using Traudt to illustrate their issues with redshirting?
Literally all evidence we have points to him wanting to transfer. HGN saying he was miserable from the second he set foot, the fact that he didnât seem excited about defense, the âhomesickness.â Of course you never fully know, counterfactuals, etc. But really? This is the case youâre using to point out flaws in redshirting?
This is tired. If you want to speculate against all available evidence, go for it. But just say itâs because the speculation supports your priors - rather than looking at the full body of information from a clear eyed perspective.
Edit to add this important part: the kid is not playing 30 mpg if he sucks at defense and doesnât want to play it.
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I would love to hear the argument for how redshirting actually gave us a chance at retaining Traudt.
Thatâs why people use Traudt. There are very reasonable interpretations as to why the redshirt hurt our chances at retaining Traudt. So, the range of evidence for redshirting via the Traudt case ranges from âit had no impactâ to âit was a contributing factor to Traudt transferringâ.
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Exactly- If he had gotten Ryan Dunn minutes all season then he would be getting Ryan Dunn accoladesâŚatleast on the offensive side. To then blow that all up and transfer to an unknown school (compared to his experience this year, playing at UVA) when his goal âwe thinkâ is to eventually go to the NBA wouldnât make sense. What would have happened is that his gf could have waited another year, or transferred to UVa in order to stay with her soon to be very lucrative boyfriend/husband. He then may have left after next season for the pros. Since that experience didnât happen, he definitely could have copped out and said that he would have left anyways even if he got 40 minutes- there is no way for us to know, but common sense says that wouldnât have happened.
Edited to Add: Even if Traudt *didnât blow up on the offensive end and wasnât great, and still was going to transfer then that is fine and maybe we would have said good riddance. We/he just didnât have the opportunity to have it play out, thaât most peoples frustration.
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Lol you guys are doing some mental gymnastics. Dude said he was almost certainly gone. Thatâs the bottom line
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I would say that if he was âmiserable the moment he set foot on campusâ, then he should have left week one. Nobody needs that kind of negativity around your team when youâre trying to accomplish big things.
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Iâm not going to get involved in the redshirt debate this time, but I am a bit curious as to how Creighton is an âunknownâ school.
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To clarify- Iâm saying that if he would have played during his one season here he could have seen what heâd have been able to produce/ competition level/ in-game response in our system. Transferring to Creighton after the season would have been an unknown for how he would have fit compared to Uva- if this had played out.
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The things that will stop me from using Traudt as an illustration of the issue with redshirting are:
- Tony stops redshirting
- Tony uses redshirting much more infrequently and only for project bigs or international project guys in general and never for US HS players in the top 100ish
- Tony keeps doing exactly what he did last year (redshirt half the class and 2 of 3 top 100 guys) and we never experience any negative effects** from it
As long as I view redshirting as having negative effects on UVa hoops, my solemn vow is that I will type posts about those negative effects (as long as Iâm interested and not otherwise busy).
With that being said, I tend to think that Traudtâs particular case will not be that illustrative in the future because, as long as Tony keeps up a similar practice (unexpectedly redshirting top 50ish players), the problem wonât be that those kids will transfer, the problem will be that those types of kids wonât be gettable in the first instance, thereby constraining further the high level talents that are gettable for us.
** by the way, Leon Bond not playing his 5th year for us will be considered a ânegative effectâ by me, me of course being the ultimate arbiter of takes made by me
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And if he fouls out in 10 minutes.
Speaking of redshirts, Iâm looking forward to seeing what Bond can do this year. He seemed to have a great attitude last year, and for that reason alone, Iâm already a fan of his.
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Looked like he had better form than Dunn when it comes to shooting. Doesnât mean he will be draining them from all over but his form looked solid to me.
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In high school he had a pretty nice mid-range pull-up game. He just struggled to consistently extend it out the three point line. Hopefully weâll see that happen.
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This is all I read from your post 
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My issue with the redshirt in this particular case is:
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It almost certainly wouldnât have hurt to play him, and you can make an argument it would have slightly improved the odds of keeping him. He probably still leaves, but redshirting likely only made things worse, especially given his own description of him not having wanted to do it coming in.
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Regardless of whether he ends up transferring or not, we could have used him last year! At the end of the year we were absolutely desperate for three point shooting and we had an elite three point shooter sitting in the bench giving us nothing. Sure, he probably would have struggled defensively and fouled - but we didnât need him for 20 minutes. Maybe in those long terrible scoring droughts when BVP was launching bricks with a broken back, he could have given us a desperately needed spark. The way to find out would have been to play him, but redshirting eliminated that option.
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Red shirting Top 50 recruits will be used against us when recruiting. Itâs not something almost any other program does. We are an outlier.
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