Not defensively though - this yearās version is more talented on D by far.
2 Likes
Now granted, is Odomās job more impressive? Sub 100 to top four seed? I think clearly. But also we got blown out, itās a bit of participation trophy and Scheyer hasnāt won it yet, so Iām not going to fight it as long as itās somewhat reasonable
1 Like
Boozer has overperformed basically every reasonable expectation you could have had for him this year, Iāll fully admit to that. I think part of it was people were focused on projecting him more as an NBA player and focusing on the athletic deficiencies he might have at that level and skipping over the fact that he was going to be more than athletic enough to be really good in college. Part of it has also been pairing him with pretty perfect front court partners in Brown and Ngongba.
I think Scheyer is totally deserving of the award, I just think some of the arguments Duke fans like @haney make are kind of bad ones. He did a phenomenal job constructing this roster and getting team buy-in to cover up the deficiencies I thought they would have preseason. Use those.
The argument falls flat to me when they start arguing about how he āpicked the best freshman of the class this yearā (he tried on DP and Dybantsa, they just didnāt have their dads name them after Dukeās home arena) and āhad to replace 5 startersā (thatās his fault! You donāt get credit for fixing a mess you put yourself in! Youāre Duke and have the luxury of building a roster anyway you want!).
Also the awardās definition is deliberately vague, so itās hard to have good arguments about it because everyoneās definition can vary enough that weāre all right which is why I donāt actually care that much who wins it.
And also screw Duke.
5 Likes
I read what youāre arguing for as ārecruitingā and I discount it somewhat because it can be done with lies (ābrotherhood!ā), money, history/blue blood status, proximity to a large pool of talent.
I would argue that assembling a roster is figuring out how to maximize the hand youāve been given and getting them to play with passion as a team. I think thatās something Odom has done very well.
2 Likes
There you go. Just run that at the end of the season.
Iād be fine with Scheyer winning coach of the year with the reasoning that heās gotten A LOT out of a talented roster, but one thatās probably, on the whole, less talented than last yearās. Heās clearly a good coach, has guys that play hard, especially defensively, buy in regardless of recruitment ranking, and, most importantly, play with incredible consistency. Plus, you have Hubert Davis as a measuring stick for someone in a similar environment with high-end talent whose teams donāt always live up to their talent level. Everyone KNEW Duke would be good, but heās still done a hell of a job.
I would love for Coach Odom to win, personally (obviously), and he would be my pick. The job heās done turning around this program and getting it back on the right track after last year, and the way heās done it with a completely new roster (minus Eli) that plays together and plays hard has been amazing to watch, even if theyāve struggled to be consistent of late. Heās done an amazing job, and it wouldnāt surprise me if the ACC wanted to honor that turnaround by rewarding the coaching job heās done here. On the whole, itās the one situation where coaching, more than any other element, has played a role in the performance of a top ACC program this year.
I also wouldnāt discard the idea of it going to Jai Lucas, whoās gotten A LOT out of a much thinner roster than either Scheyer or Odom. Yes, he has high-end talent, but that doesnāt guarantee success, and the way he has that team playing now is inspired. Miami was picked to finish eighth in the ACC, and now theyāre finishing third and ranked. Heās done a great job, and if heās honored for that, itād make all the sense in the world to me.
4 Likes
Iām moderately confident that if one did things this way, Kyle Smith would be COY.
3 Likes
Can you imagine if we lost a game like this? The board might melt down and explode.
https://x.com/JoshReynolds24/status/2029825005895471390?s=20
4 Likes
Of course, Parrish and Norlander just said Scheyer is COY, with Jai Lucas ārunner-upā COY (which they admittedly made up); not even a mention of Odom. Ridiculous.
FWIW in KenPomās model, Scheyer was #1 among coaches in his hiring class (In the article he says that because of randomness you canāt really compare guys with just a few years to Kelvin Sampson)
Actually, itās more like saying Harvard provides the best education because theyāve hired the best professors. And that is absolutely a fair measure.
If weāre going to measure coaches based only on how much they maximize the talent on their team, Tony should have been a serious contender his last two years. Because those were not great rosters.
1 Like
Iām sorry, but I donāt super see Jaiās case unless you give him credit for being a first-time HC which I donāt personally think should factor in. He played a laughable ACC schedule (not his fault, I know, but still) and a team of relatively proven high major talent. We also had a first year HC that not only won the head-to-head but finished above them in the standings (and had to play Duke).
Scheyer Iām fine with winning, Lucas getting extra credit for being a first time HC seems out of the scope of the award.
And itās not like Miami can cry poor over NIL either.
And this might work against him, but I think Odom should get a lot of credit for the euro influx and production. Thatās clearly been a massive success and heās really on the cutting edge of it.
5 Likes
The case for Miami is that its an even bigger turnaround. They were dumpster fire bad last year
1 Like
I feel like the baseline doesnāt matter that much if youāre flipping the entire roster anyways, but maybe thatās just me. They were in the final 4 not long before that! We only have one tournament appearance (in the first four) since they were in the final 4!
3 Likes
Best Euro influx - Odom
Best coach who quits on teams midseason - Jai
Best coach of Duke whoās not an actual Devil - Scheyer
Best at waking up in the morning and finding meaning despite it all - Earl Grant
āI run this conference and donāt forget itā - Brad Brownell
Best at finishing in the Enfield zone (45-55 in Kenpom) - Enfield
Best at preseason hype cycles - (tie) Wade / Kelsey
Best dancer - Madsen
12 Likes
lol. Butā¦ he does make like $2 million a year. Heāll be all right.
3 Likes
YEP. See: Pat Kelsey at Louisville
2 Likes
I would bet that if you compared the preseason ACC predictions they do at media day to the final standings, there would be correlation between Coach of the year winners and the team that finished in the top 4 that most overperformed its preseason prediction. And maybe thereās a special circumstance for a team predicted to finish 1st that actually finishes 1st (maybe only outright or by multiple games).
Generally the same people vote in the preseason media poll and the postseason awards. The preseason predictions take into account roster talent and coaching acumen. So the coach is outperforming the projected level off his roster and also his own projected coaching ability.
Like, if you wouldāve picked Virginia 6th, but you put them 4th because of Tony Bennett and they finished 2nd, that credits Bennett with both building a roster that is actually better than the public perception of it and coaching that roster better than the publicās view of how much they perceive he already adds as a coach.
K never won in recent years because Duke was always vote preseason to win the conference and they almost never did. Bennett won a bunch because we were never predicted to win the conference, but we did 6 times in his last 11 seasons.
6 Likes
He truly has done it again, amazing work
6 Likes