Iāll spare the other thread my continued thoughts on lack of fan engagement, and interrupt the Hugs chatter here to comment on one of @jphat007 's fair points:
He notes that there arenāt thousands of UVa die-hards beating down the door to watch a B/W stream. I think this is absolutely correct. But my point is that thereās a virtuous feedback loop here. There are probably less than a hundred people like me who are annoyed by this. And if it streamed, thereād be only a few hundred people watching it. But you can already see the difference ā only a few people like me who actively care, but several times more that amount who would watch. And then more who would see highlights get retweeted or grammed or whatever onto their timelines. And then more people become aware, and want to watch it next year. Etc. We wonāt get UNC or Duke or Kansas-like engagement. But we have lots of fans out there who mostly tune out from April to November because theyāve been trained to tune out, and if you train more of them not to tune out, then they wouldnāt.
(But yes, on this, I am also selfish. Iād really like to get my first real glimpse of the new guys and see how they mesh with the old guys, and I know I wonāt get that until garbage time of the first few games).
I know for a fact that my dad has no idea this forum exists and has no opinion on streaming but if UVA opened up a stream for $15 he would pay it in a heartbeat lol
Hope that worked moving to a different thread. @jphat007 think you might have the right idea here. In addition to the title, somewhere around that time was when Williams took over. Maybe Littlepage had the clout to overrule Tony on off the court decisions because he had been an AD for so long but Carla didnāt at first? Overrule probably isnāt even the right term maybe TB just deferred to CL because of the experience? And when a green AD came in he started to do it his way? And now, even though Carla is more experienced, the dynamic is what it is and it would be difficult to change?
Heh, Iām trying to limit myself to 10 or so streaming complaints on any threads where folks might be looking for actual hoops content (as opposed to my ramblings on Cincinatti area hoops).
How long did it take you all to learn how to spell Cincinnati? I consider myself a good speller and never get itā¦
heh thatās a smart approach, Iām all about derailing as many threads as possible as long as I humor myself.
Always call it the Nati or Cinci makes life a lot easier. But I also went to school in the day when mail was a thing so you had to write out the address a ton and got used to it pretty quickly.
Ironically, after my streaming rants, I went looking for streaming info on the Overtime Elite games that Elijah will be playing in on Fri/Sat, and I found out:
Heās not even playing the Dave Leitao / Thompson Twins OTE, but some off-brand OTE team
Streaming is available, but costs $40. $40!!! Thatās nuts. That would be UVa hoops ultimate troll to me. Heck, Iād probably pay 40 to see the blue/white (and complain) but no way Iām paying $40 to see something the best parts of which will be all over IG the next day.
Itās in Roselle Catholicās gym for anyone whoās interested, and Tahaad is playing, too.
Iām wondering what there is to gain that we donāt already have? High game attendance (and higher ticket prices)? Recruiting momentum? A national championship?
Thereās no connection between self exposure and game results. NC State has a lot more social media posts than UVA and they suck and are riddled with a delusional fan base. Our football team has a whole lot more Twitter posts to generate excitement, but there are now fewer people at the games than at meet-the-team day.
UVA culture has always been - if the team is good, weāll go support them until the end of the season. And then weāll see you next season. Itās just not a rabid, sports-centric school. And yet we still win nattyās in most of our sports.
@Serum114 made the point already, but in a NIL landscape, being able to market the program like this becomes even more important than it already was. I donāt want us to be the leader in this type of stuff, I just want us to keep our competitors in our sights.
All this stuff is marginal, but at the margins, itās more attention on the program, which is good for merch, eyeballs, recruiting, admissions, etc. Like I said, marginal, marginal, marginal. The biggest thing is success, but fan service matters, too.
None of these things are biggies in and of themselves, but I think they start to add up. Remember Kyle Guy watching college gameday with his family in the stands? You donāt think heād love to have been featured in a 5-minute piece? Look how much Ty loved his post-natty revenge tour in the media. Our best players are not (necessarily) media or camera shy. They do what their coach wants them to do.
But Iām not hiding from the obvious truth here, either. I love hoops and I get annoyed that Tony has a āno hoops for youā attitude, unless āyouā lives in Charlottesville or is in easy enough travel distance to attend. (in other words, this is mostly about me)
Finally, I donāt want to over-exaggerate this, but I also donāt want to under-exaggerate this, either. When new types of media emerge, we should embrace them, not hide from them, and just say, everything is fine.
So, basically, I guess whatās to gain is new fans and more eyeballs from old fans, and on-court success is obviously table stakes here, so yeah, the fact that crappy teams (NC St / UVa football) have good social media / access is a bit moot to the topic, IMO.
I just listened to that pod with Rothstein. Man I feel like he was speaking directly to this topic.
Heās doing things his way or heās outta here. I think that is all encompassing, NIL, brand promotion, doing certain things to get recruits. He wants to find out if he can do it his way with it still working or heās peaceān out.
And thatās fine. My advice to Tony would be the same as it would to anyone whoās accumulated his amount of wealth: do what you love, do what makes you happy, do what gives your life purpose. If thatās no longer UVa hoops, then so be it.
But I canāt for the life of me understand how Tony fulfilling his mission in life is directly contrary to me being able to watch his team play from the comfort of my iPad / laptop / etc.
I donāt think he likes self promotion is what I think is the basis of it. Whether its coach, player, or program. Just like how he hated gameday. How could you hate gameday?
Again, Iām not arguing its right, smart, naive, whatever. But itās what he believes. And Iād much rather win and get shitty highlights and no streamed scrimmage than to go back to Leitao or Gillen. And I realize thatās a false equivalency, we can obviously find another Tony Bennett (or a handful of other coaches that have been good at a school like ours), and be somewhat successful, but itās not very likely at all.
So I hope Tony finds a way to do it however he wants.
I mean this is a bigger discussion than just streaming the scrimmage. Just part of the pattern of UVA not caring about fans who canāt donate big money. It seems as an institution we fail to see the value in the ālittle guyā so to speak. Another example is they have the football coach publicly calling out fans for not attending games when the product on the field sucks and the amenities at the game are lacking.
And there is a very easy example of how that stuff adds up one state south of us. At some point youād think someone high up in the AD or the VAF would notice the difference in small donations between UVA and UNC and start to wonder what they are doing differently than usā¦
once again I will note the āselfishā comment from earlier. Tony does not have to like self-promotion bc he makes millions a year. Maybe his players would like a little extra promotion. And it also isnāt self-promotion to have an athletics program advertise the hoops team. And I donāt think any of us think Tony needs to be the one manning the camera
I think thatās a perfectly legitimate thought process. But the alternative is no Bennett. So to your point in the other thread, do you want to win or do you want to see a mediocre (hopefully) team a lot?
As an intellectual curiosity I would love to hear how TB squares being a control freak with the humility pilar lol but doubt anyone that isnāt very close with him would be able to have that honest of a conversation with a college football or basketball coach.
Well then that does hurt our program some. Itās not just about NIL and Brand it hurts fans who wany any form of engagement to feel like they are a part of the team and culture.
I think when you bring up āPeople are going to miss Tony when heās goneā you are assuming that people want to force Tony out. Itās not all or nothing. Of course we are all going to miss Tony when he is gone but
Our complaints are still valid and Tony being here or not doesnāt change that
You mention that UVA canāt do better than Tony. Holland made 2 final 4s. We have JPJ, resources, and donors and a lot to pitch. Acknowledging this doesnāt mean we donāt appreciate Tony or are trying to force him out.
Just because we want what most other fan bases get and what we used to get not 3 years ago does not mean we are not capable of appreciate of our current situation.
We were mediocre last year. Weāve been pretty mediocre since the natty benefitting from a weak ACC and getting blown out against every real team we play in the nonconference.
You can have fun supporting a team regardless of the situation on the court through fan engagement, building on those attachments, etc.
Again none of this is saying āPush Tony outā thatās silly. But Tony isnāt free from criticism. No one is perfect despite our wants to find idols in our life.